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Proper break in for 2-stroke engine

Snowmobile How-To's

 
 
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  #1  
Old 01-03-2010
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Snowmobile Break In Procedure (TRAIL ENGINE)

-Never use dry gas in a 2 stroke-cycle engine.((((ethanol)))))

-Even dry gas that reads "safe for two cycle" will lean the fuel mixture caused by the alchohol.((((ethanol))))

- Flush the fuel system before running the motor. Be sure that there is no water in the tank.

Before starting your overhauled snowmobile engine please do the following:

-Mix oil with the fuel at 50/1 with an oil injected motor and double manufactures recommendation for normal use on premix sleds/ for the 1st 10 hrs of operation.

-Use 89 octane unless the compression ratio has been increased and/or the manufacturer states otherwise.

-Start your engine at home to verify that it actually does start.

-Use you choke as little as possible to get your machine started. It washes the oil off the cylinder walls.

-Do not run the engine any longer than it takes for it to reach normal operating temperature and never ride the snowmobile or rev the engine above 4,000 rpm's no matter what until the engine has reached normal operating temperature.

- Now you may go for a ride (one up and not towing).

-Do not exceed 3/4 throttle when riding for the first 2 hrs.

-Vary the speed from idle until you have at least two hours on the engine.

-It is time consuming and tedious but it is the basis for long and happy engine life.

-At this point (after 2 hrs.) you can ride the your sled periodically giving it short runs (up to 20 seconds) up to full throttle.

-This should continue until there 4hrs total (aprox.) on the engine, then your newly rebuilt engine should be broken in allowing you to now and only now use it for the intent and purpose of design.

-If you follow the outlined procedures you will get better service from your engine. Be sure that at maximum throttle the engine will turn up to its proper wide open RPM, the top operating RPM for your snowmobile is found listed in your owners manual.

-If the sled doesn't achieve or it goes over the specified maximum R.P.M., the engine can become damaged almost immediately so shut it off.

-The wrong clutch components/adjustments and or fuel jets/ and or other variables can cause the motor to lug, overheat or at the other extreme over rev and destroy all your good work.

-Never run the sled when it is out of its intended elevation, temperature, or snow conditions.

-Be sure to re-torque of the cylinder head bolts if required .

-I would also Not use synthetic oil during this breakin period. Synthetics are too slippery and will delay the actual times needed. It will take longer for the rings to seat if at all.

Last edited by PolarisRich : 01-05-2010 at 07:05 AM.
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  #2  
Old 01-03-2010
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Copied and put in How-To's.

Thanks Rich.
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  #3  
Old 01-03-2010
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I remember breaking in diesels at john deere. 15 minute idle, if anything was going to happen them first couple minutes are where they usually do. then after an hour it was ready for 80% load for an hour then 90% load for an hour then 100% load for a 1/2 hour. do that with a sled! wide open full power for a half hour.


on the sleds that first start up where the sled sits and idles till warm, there is a lot going on, the pistons are setting themselves to the cylinder and same with the rings.
its a good time to watch and smell for leaks.
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  #4  
Old 01-04-2010
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Sorry for the double post but I think this should be in this "How to"!!!

I have read this "fast breakin procedure" before. Ride it like they stole it Method.


Trust me when I say that I am not thoroughly convinced that this is a good way to break in a engine at all. I know that if you ask 100 people this same question you'll get 100 differant anwsers. Here's my reasoning, don't take it the wrong way this is just my opinion. 1 of 100.....

First off..
If you plan on keeping the sled, going against the manufacturers suggestion of breakin is something that I find to be strange and in the words of our good Dr. Spock "Very Illogical".
There is always a warranty to protect you if you did break it in wrong but did it according to instructions from the company that makes the sled. Why would the manufacturer who has to pay big money to fix these high tech machines want you to do it the wrong way?

Secondly..
Virtually every manufacturer tells you the same thing. Go easy to start with lots of variation of throttle. No high speed runs for awhile and keep the throttle at mild bursts for several hours on the new engine. Could it be a conspericy to wreck your engine? I don't think so.

Thirdly...
Some people say... "see I have been doing this for a long time with run it like you stole it" approach and "gosh nothing has gone wrong yet".

Well, in order to do any test in a reasonable approach you need to follow scientific processes.

"You need a control."

That is you need to have a bunch of sleds all made from the same manufacturer with the same engines, with the same oils and the same weight riders riding them under the same temperature conditions and with the same fuels. Some of the riders break-in like the manufacturer suggests, the other riders... ride them like they stole it.

Then you need to tear the sleds engines down and do a thorough analysis with the best equipment you can test with. When you do that you then have the control. If and only if you've done this then you can make comments on how good the Fast Break-In Procedure is.
But most times it's just someone who has talked to mechanics who have taken the motors apart over time and were happy with what they saw. Maybe the engine was looking good in spite of what happened at breakin.
It is a tribute to a well designed and built motor with great components that despite rough abuse at breakin it was still looking good. Some People also says that you only have 20 miles to accomplish real breakin before parts get smooth and no further breakin is possible. I personally think this is a line of crap.

Parts wear in over time.

Not just 20 miles of hard riding. They get looser and looser and looser over time. This looseness results from wear-in. Giving things a chance to get good lubrication back to critical places after a quick burst of throttle makes sense to me, where as extended long term full throttle runs will thin out lubrication even more in a close tolerance tight fitting Engine that has barely had time to mate with it's counter part. In fact you could be building a metal deposit for lack of proper lubrication which is a time bomb just waiting to do in the crank or ring at some unspecified time well out of warranty protection.



I know that there are various opinions on this, and if you want to go against the flow, go for it. Motors will always need repairs, and mechanics have to make a living. If everybody did it right, the business of repairing and replacing engine parts would take a big dive and then who would fix my sled when I get 50,000 miles on it


Arctic Cat gives information on break-in procedures

The Arctic Cat engine requires a short break-in period (approximately 10 operating hours) before being subjected to heavy load conditions or fullthrottle operation. Strict adherence to the break-in procedure will contribute to optimum performance and longevity of the engine. During break-in, a maximum of 1/2 throttle is recommended; however, brief full-throttle accelerations and variations in driving speeds contribute to good engine break-in. After the 10 hour break-in period, the snowmobile may be taken to an authorized Arctic Cat Snowmobile dealer for a checkup and oil change. This service is at the discretion and expense of the snowmobile owner.

Here are some guidelines for break-ins:

0-200 miles ½ throttle (45 mph Max)
200-400 miles ½ to ¾ throttle
400-600 miles ½ to ¾ throttle with occasional full throttle operation

Last edited by PolarisRich : 01-04-2010 at 02:03 PM.
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  #5  
Old 01-04-2010
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More oil is not necesarily safer for a motor. Oil displaces fuel and can create a lean condition and burn down the sled. In fact this is more likely to happen than ethanol burning down the sled.
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  #6  
Old 01-04-2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple650indy View Post
More oil is not necesarily safer for a motor. Oil displaces fuel and can create a lean condition and burn down the sled. In fact this is more likely to happen than ethanol burning down the sled.
More oil is not a necessity but more of a recommendation when breaking in a "rebuilt engine". Breakin of a brand new sled does not necesarily need more oil added to the fuel.

Now I havent heard of too much oil hurting a sled other than plug fouling. I could belive the lean condition could maybe happen in a fuel injected engine more so than a carbureted engine.

I would like to learn more on this condition, if you have a link to where I can read more about this I would greatly appreciate it. Thanks!
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  #7  
Old 01-04-2010
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rich your post is a good one and for our target client base of the website it will serve them well. and i would say people should follow it.

now to play devils advocate many people have broke in engines on the race track. granted a race engine doenst have to last thousands of miles. but when the only time its running its at full hp. some of the fastest times you see on a sled is with a brand new engine that has only a couple blurps on it.
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  #8  
Old 01-05-2010
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Thanks Jon!! That means alot to me!
I agree with you 100% on your last post.
Race engines are not supposed to last 10,000 miles. Your lucky if you get one season on a race engine. Heat cycles and grip and rip are fine on a race sled because if blows your not going to be far away from a track or some type of civilization. Unlike a trail sled, you could be up in the Arctic Circle a 1000 miles away from a single person.
Now with that said, I guess I should have added (NON RACE) or (Trail Sled) into the title of this thread. This would cleared up some of the differances of opinions.
I guess the reason I wrote this thread was because a fellow sledder asked .. How do I break in my rebuilt triple? Since he did not state if it was a race engine, I perceived it to be a trail sled and wrote the best way that I know how to break in a 2 Cycle Engine for dependability and longevity. Now I don't build RACE engines and I'm not a seasoned Race mechanic. And to tell you the truth I would love to read a "Detailed" Break-in process from one of the Super Snow Cross Mechanics for lets say Blair Morgan!
Thanks guys, I'll try to be a little clearer on what I post in the future.
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Old 01-05-2010
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Jon what is your opinion on post #5? Curious
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Old 01-05-2010
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theres some truth to it. but, when you premix the gas you are taking away the risk of any damage from lack of oil if there is air in the injection system.
oil displaces gas, but i have a hard time seeing that it would cause a lean condition. the oil takes more energy to burn. so by removing a drop of gas and replacing it with a drop of oil would actually create a rich condition. it would be like running race fuel. the oil absorbs so much more heat than the gas before it burns it would act like an octane booster.


thank god it was post 5, if i have to go to my second hand to count i get lost.
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Old 01-05-2010
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Thanks Jon, nice post, my thoughts exactly!
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Old 01-05-2010
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I can only see too much oil leaning out an engine if it was run at WOT and even then I would think it would foul out before you could get anything hot enough. If you are running the proper plug the oil will impede the ability of the spark plug to fire, thus reducing combustion efficiency which would lower piston temps.
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to much oil will create a rich condition causing a plug fouling.

on your first tank if you put a pint to a quart of oil in a full tank you might foul a plug depends on temps, thats still a small price of insurance vs scoring a brand new engine because there was some air in the injection system.
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Old 01-05-2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Madcow View Post
theres some truth to it. but, when you premix the gas you are taking away the risk of any damage from lack of oil if there is air in the injection system.
oil displaces gas, but i have a hard time seeing that it would cause a lean condition. the oil takes more energy to burn. so by removing a drop of gas and replacing it with a drop of oil would actually create a rich condition. it would be like running race fuel. the oil absorbs so much more heat than the gas before it burns it would act like an octane booster.


thank god it was post 5, if i have to go to my second hand to count i get lost.
Or you could just bleed the oil injection properly and eliminate the risk of air in the system and ensure it works. Otherwise you're just doing a half assed job. I broke the RXL in with no extra oil. In fact no motor should require added oil on break in. If you want to do a good job do the proper steps on rebuild and you're motor will last, otherwise once you stop adding the extra oil you're just going to destroy a bearing anyways if you oil injection is truly not working.
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Old 01-05-2010
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Well, since my sled is EFI, it says in my shop manual to wire the oil pump to wide open for at least an hour after a rebuild and then just run it normally, because oil run through the micro screens will clog them.
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Mircro screens? Where are they running micro screens on the Arctic Cat EFI?
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Old 01-05-2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by OCR View Post
because oil run through the micro screens will clog them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by PolarisRich View Post
Now I havent heard of too much oil hurting a sled other than plug fouling. I could belive the lean condition could maybe happen in a fuel injected engine more so than a carbureted engine.
Thats what I thought RJ!!!! Thanks.
I guess what everyone here is trying to say is that adding a little bit of oil won't hurt your sled during the break-in procdure only! Like I said it's not a necessity but more of a recommendation! Better to be safe than sorry.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple650indy
"In fact no motor should require added oil on break in. If you want to do a good job do the proper steps on rebuild and you're motor will last"
Let me see if I'm understanding you right! Are you saying that there is no need or "benifit" at all to adding any extra oil to the fuel only during break-in!

A great rebuild and following all the proper steps to that rebuild is only 90% of the job. The other 10% is the proper break-in of that rebuilt engine. The entire break-in process is to ensure the the bearings and the crank lap together with the proper radial dimensions, also the rings have to wear or conform the the cylinder walls an so on and so on bla bla bla......

Sure you can break an engine with no extra oil in the fuel, sure you break in a rebuilt engine with just a properly bled oil injector. Can you break-in an engine at 50:1? Sure why not!!!! You can break-in an engine many ways and like I said earlier 100 differant people 100 differant ways. But what were talking about here is the "SAFEST WAY" for break-in. Now if you have undeniable proof that there is no benifit what so ever to adding a small amount of oil to the first tank of gas in a "Rebuilt motor" than I would love to see it! But I'll tell you this! I can post hundreds of websites, post and threads that all state that adding oil "won't" hurt your sled.
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Old 01-05-2010
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple650indy View Post
Mircro screens? Where are they running micro screens on the Arctic Cat EFI?
Are you just trying to be difficult?

All fuel injectors have Micro screens this is why they plug up!
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Old 01-05-2010
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I was not trying to be difficult, I was trying to understand the system. Is it wrong to ask a stupid question and not know what you're talking about or is it stupid to just not know?
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PolarisRich View Post
Thats what I thought RJ!!!! Thanks.
I guess what everyone here is trying to say is that adding a little bit of oil won't hurt your sled during the break-in procdure only! Like I said it's not a necessity but more of a recommendation! Better to be safe than sorry.




Let me see if I'm understanding you right! Are you saying that there is no need or "benifit" at all to adding any extra oil to the fuel only during break-in!

A great rebuild and following all the proper steps to that rebuild is only 90% of the job. The other 10% is the proper break-in of that rebuilt engine. The entire break-in process is to ensure the the bearings and the crank lap together with the proper radial dimensions, also the rings have to wear or conform the the cylinder walls an so on and so on bla bla bla......

Sure you can break an engine with no extra oil in the fuel, sure you break in a rebuilt engine with just a properly bled oil injector. Can you break-in an engine at 50:1? Sure why not!!!! You can break-in an engine many ways and like I said earlier 100 differant people 100 differant ways. But what were talking about here is the "SAFEST WAY" for break-in. Now if you have undeniable proof that there is no benifit what so ever to adding a small amount of oil to the first tank of gas in a "Rebuilt motor" than I would love to see it! But I'll tell you this! I can post hundreds of websites, post and threads that all state that adding oil "won't" hurt your sled.
Safest, if you want to be safe why don't you premix all the time? The fact is what you're doing is completely unnecesary if the rebuild is done to the letter. Also crank dimensions are set when the crank is pressed together. The manufacturer designs it for thermal expansions. Again there is not advantage to what you're doing, its just another pointless tidbit everyone thinks is necessary because someone told them to be safe. Again, premix all the time if you want to be "safe."
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Triple650indy View Post
Safest, if you want to be safe why don't you premix all the time? The fact is what you're doing is completely unnecesary if the rebuild is done to the letter. Also crank dimensions are set when the crank is pressed together. The manufacturer designs it for thermal expansions. Again there is not advantage to what you're doing, its just another pointless tidbit everyone thinks is necessary because someone told them to be safe. Again, premix all the time if you want to be "safe."
You say potato I say potato!!! WHAT EVER!!!

Sorry I must have taken you Question in the wrong context. I ment no harm! I am truly sorry!

Now I would like you to prove to me that what I have said is a "pointless tidbit"
The reason that I ask is because... I would like to tell all the people and my professors that I went to College (Motive Power Technologies)for 4 years with and Barry Maskery who is "Top ten American Motor Knowledge with SAE) and Research and Development for Polaris that they are all WRONG!!!

This is not a pointless tidbit!!! It is a well known "suggestion" that will cause no harm.
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Old 01-05-2010
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Right from Snowgoer Magazine....


Break It In Properly, Or You'll Break It


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It’s really hard to keep your hand off of full throttle when riding a brand-new snowmobile. You just paid a bunch of bucks for that high-performance sled and you want to feel what it can do to stimulate your senses. But is it safe to squeeze the throttle to the bar?

Through the years, there have been owners who say, “Just ride the heck out of it like you always do and it will be just fine.” Well, if you ride it like that, you’ll be taking your chances. When it comes to a snowmobile, there are two components that certainly need a break-in period: the engine and the drive belt.

In the case of the belt, it’s a matter of cleaning both pulleys of the preservatives that have been sprayed on them for protection in the shipping crates. With the engine, it requires more time and a well-disciplined throttle thumb.



300 Miles, Or Up To 10 Hours

The manufacturers know what works best for their machines and they tell you about it in the owner’s manual. There’s a lot of debate about how you should break in a new snowmobile, and each manufacturer has somewhat different procedures noted in its manuals on how to do it.

Some engine management computers are mapped to keep the operator from extracting full power during the break-in period. The systems retard the ignition timing and enrich the fuel delivery for a prescribed amount of time before allowing the engine to perform at its peak.

The major break-in period for most sleds is considered 300 miles, or six to 10 hours. The piston rings seating with the cylinder bore is the major concern with the first period of use for any engine. During that break-in time, avoid jackrabbit starts, but constantly vary the engine speed.

Cylinder pressure is what forces the piston rings against the bore of the cylinder to knock down the high spots on the bore and rings. High cylinder pressures allow the rings to seat more quickly with the bore, which means high throttle positions can be used during the break-in period; just don’t hold the throttle wide open for more than a few seconds at a time. Conversely, putzing along at slow speeds will not allow the rings to seat properly.

If the rings aren’t seated correctly, cylinder pressure that’s supposed to be trapped between the piston dome and cylinder head will blow between the rings and cylinder for the life of the engine, resulting in less peak horsepower. Joe Average might not notice a performance difference, but inspection after at least 1,000 miles would reveal the piston skirts are discolored brown and black.

The only things that need break-in on a two-stroke are the cylinder bores, pistons and piston rings. In the case of two-strokes, Environmental Protection Agency emissions limits have forced manufacturers to reduce oil delivery rates as low as possible. In most cases, the sled manufacturers want you to increase oil delivery by adding some oil to the first full tank of fuel.

In the case of a four-stroke, the cam needs to turn along with the followers. The pistons, cylinders and rings also need some movement before full load — for a sustained period — is applied against them. Most engines use anti-friction bearings (ball, roller or needle bearings), but a few of the four-strokes continue to use flat bearings, which require some break-in, too.

Yamaha wants its four-strokes to be idled for 15 minutes before they are ridden. During break-in, however, engine overheating is a concern and must be avoided on all makes and models. To break in the engine during the summer months with ambient temperatures around 75 degrees F, the engine can be idled for three, five-minute periods with cooling periods between. Whether new or old, all engines must be warmed up to avoid cold seizures, especially two-strokes.
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Old 01-05-2010
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you can bleed the system but there is always a risk.

if i do one for anyone else i put some wire on the oil pump handle and give it a pull to fog the motor, then you know its working.

DONT RUN A PUMP AND PREMIX? damn right, if you seen how the pump works when its cold out and you start the sled, its amazing that our sleds last as long as they do.
i havent ran an oil system on a sled for several years. not worth the risk. and the good oils wont even go through a pump anyhow.


john deere had it down, they made a break in oil. if you tried to break in an engine with conventional oil it would never really seat the rings and you would have an oil using engine from day one.

sleds its harder to see how good the rings take set. thats why i am a little hard on them, do some heat cycles to let everything loosen up, after that start putting some load on it. the rings need load to seat, if not they just wear off the hash marks and never take a seat.
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  #24  
Old 01-05-2010
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Triple650indy
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Of course there is always a risk. When I came out my door today there was a risk I could fall and break my tail bone too. Risks are always there, but then you might as well premix all the time if that is your mentality. But by adding oil to your first tank your just wasting oil.

As far as oil pumps, I've been riding for 20 years and never have I seen one fail. Never have I rebuilt a motor and not seen one pump when its cold. I have never had a single bad experience with an oil pump.

Rings seat not because of a good oil, but because of a good cross-hatch. Wear is natural, and the wear a ring will under go when it first pushed through a fresh cylinder is key, no sled needs more oil to make an rings seat any better. Normal wear under normal conitions is the best way to break in a sled. That has always been my approach. Go nuts do it under load, that's normal conditions, but the engine will not see adverse effects by not adding more oil unless you did a half-assed job on the rebuild.
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Last edited by Triple650indy : 01-05-2010 at 12:18 PM.
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  #25  
Old 01-05-2010
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I'm Done with this! ENJOY
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